Black Heart Bart


Just how appalling are our weight for age horses if a nine year old who has not won a race for more than two and a half years flogs our best weight for age horses. Add to that, three of the four placings were all aged nine years or more.

These are the same no hopers that Winx used to flog causing Gary to sob his heart out and declare Winx the greatest horse ever..

If anyone is still unsure as to why Winx never travelled, just have at a look at the Underwood yesterday and you will be enlightened.

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Hey Gladys, During her 33 race winning streak, how many times did you think she was beaten at the turn?

To be honest Gary, in her first few victories I thought she might be in trouble of reaching the leaders. After the first few races of her winning sequence however, I got a good handle on the appalling standard of the opposition and the role of the stablemates so from then on I thought that only an accident or the jockey falling off would stop her.

I layed her several times, not on the basis that I thought that the opposition had any talent, but more so on these factors.

Since her retirement and the quality (or lack thereof) of the goats that have taken out our premier weight for age races, I realise that my previous assessment of their appalling standard was completely correct.

Forumites, in most circumstances, it appears that "Add Comment" is a better way to go than "Add reply"

Hello Glady's ,  at last I've found you.         I thought of you and your Husband ( Khap ) When that Blackhearted Bart stole from us on Saturday.           .  I'm now a tennis Punter.        they retire at 40.

Hi Macca, great to hear from you. Can you believe it but I included BHB in a box quinella and had it a few times. It paid $125 in NSW so I was very pleased.

As to the result, you would need a diving bell to find the credibility of that appalling opposition as it is so low. I could run faster than most of them.

Hope you have been keeping well and backing lots of winners.

I'm clicking "Add comment" to opening post, instead of "Add reply" to most recent post. I think it will make the process more efficient.

Gladys, you cite views of great Australian trainers. but when I respond, you discount their views as polite and irrelevant. Which is it?







Wayne Hawkes? A great Australian trainer? His father is, not him.

Gary, it would not matter what I said, you will keep banging on about Winx being the greatest horse in Australian history.. Any horse from the past that I have mentioned would have rounded up those no hopers that she beat and belted them just the same as she did.

If she had ever raced against good horses she would not have had the dream run that she had. She was the best or her era and that is all. Her era was easily the worst era in Australian history for weight for age middle distance horses.

I admit that she able to remain sound throughout the period she raced. That is all she had to do. The Clerk of Course's horse and the pony they do the interviews from would have filled the places in the races she contested.

Now leave it alone for a while please.


Here's the views of two of the four trainers you mentioned;

Wayne Hawkes: “It might be another 50 years before we find a mare like this" (referring to Winx and Black Caviar)

David Hayes" "I'll make sure I shake Chris' (Waller) hand and say 'I am sure you've made the right decision' (to retire her)." The Hall Of Fame trainer has long considered Winx unbeatable and said none of Lindsay Park's past stars would have threatened her. "I've had nothing that would be near her," he said of his 30-year career as a trainer. "Better Loosen Up was a great horse but he lasted one season at the top. "There's been four generations of horses have a crack at her and she's still undefeated. "She's by far the best I've ever seen."

Trainers all say nice things about the opposition. Show me one post where a trainer has maligned or ridiculed another trainer's horses.

Who was the best horse she beat Gary? Maybe not those horses I have already mentioned. Maybe it was Sons of John!

"Trainers all say nice things about the opposition"

Yes, just to be nice, all trainers say, "she's by far the best I've ever seen": "I've had nothing that would be near her" "It might be another 50 years before we find a mare like this".


When Wayne Hawkes speaks, everybody listens. Why don't you quote a few of the northern hemisphere trainers, see what they say.

I recall the great Bart saying "It's not what you win, it's what you beat"

Sons of John? Foxwedge? Red Excitement?

Just how great were Fenway and First Seal!

It is very sad Gary that the only way you can justify your jaundiced view on Winx is to rubbish some of our great horses of yesterday.

All this "going through the gears" or "it is not who she beat but how she beat them" or the classic, "all the good horses are hiding from her" is just total tripe.

The way to confront people like me who don't gush over a good horse beating no hopers is to put me in my place by detailing the top liners that she met and defeated. It is quite obvious that you cannot do this so you resort to denigrating our top liners of another era thinking that will enhance Winx. Sadly, it just does not.

The fact that she won so many consecutive races just highlights the appalling opposition, or more so the complete lack of opposition, that she faced. Our top liners of the past would not have been able to achieve this as they faced quality opposition most of the time. They may have had a few easier races some times, but generally they were up against quality opposition. I would love you to go and see the Hawkes, Waterhouses, Rails and Hayes of this world and tell them that you thought their champions were a pack of duds. No one ever did that. How many people have proffered the view that although Winx is the best of her generation, she has beaten nothing. Be honest, quite a few.

BC travelling and winning made no difference to your opinion. Similarly, a Winx victory O/S would have meant nothing to you.

Different day! Only the depth varies. I liked it when Glad actually gave us a couple of tips. I think Moses was still in nappies then. You're  flogging a dead horse Gary. The Pig.

At least BC travelled and it was not her fault she met a weak field. The horse that she beat into second had never won at the distance. Winx was never going anywhere, She was destined to stay in Australia and beat no hopers so that clowns in the press could sob their hearts out and declare her the greatest since Phar Lap. I could wait around until I was older than Methuselah and still not learn the name of a decent horse she ever beat.

If you think the Underwood was a crook race just have a look at the Epsom, Metropolitan and Flight Stakes on Saturday.

The Epsom is the worst field in more than twenty years. The Metropolitan is just like a mid week distance race at Canterbury and the Flight Stakes, strewth, Six horses, two of them are maidens the rest are struggling to be Saturday class.

When these races have been run, one of the total duds will be classed as a Group One horse. Look at the money they are running for and look at the appalling quality that is contesting the races.

What do you think Might and Power, Vo Rogue, Sunline or Northerly would have done to that Underwood field?

"At least BC travelled and it was not her fault she met a weak field". Yes Gladys, she should hve been shuttled to another planet. Nothing good enough on Earth. 

"What do you think... Northerly would have done to that Underwood field?"

Gladys, Northerly's average winning margin was half a length, so I guess it may have won by half a length. Would you like to guess what Winx would have done to Northerly and that field?  Or are you still touting Northerly by 12 lengths?


Northerly won by small margins because he was competing against quality opposition.

Winx would not have got past him, he would have gapped her. Vo Rogue  would have had  Winx in convulsions at the 800 metre mark. There would have been none of this sitting out the back and sprinting past stable mates, old handicappers and the usual no hopers. a quality horse like Super Impose could not raise the energy to sprint when competing against Vo Rogue.

Remember back when you and the Parrot were telling Khap and myself that "all the good horses were avoiding Winx" Where are they now she has retired. What are their names? They were the ones being flogged by nine year olds last weekend I think.

Name the "quality opposition", Northerly beat, or was beaten by..

Sorry, my mistake. You are absolutely right, as usual, Gary.

Sunline, Lonhro and Fields of Omagh were all total duds.

They would not even be in the same street as Red Excitement, Foxwedge or Invictus Prince would they!

Sunline, Lonhro and Fields of Omagh. Ah yes, an even bunch which all took their turns at being champions. First Sunline, then Northerly and then when neither was around, Fields of Omagh. And just like Bart On Saturday, FOO was 9yo when it won its 2nd Cox Plate. As for Lonhro, well it never won a Cox Plate, but what the hell, it had a very nice two furlong turn of foot.  

Tell me sunshine, which of those horses above, including Northerly, could go through its gears, round up the field in the twinkling of an eye, sustain a sprint for 800 metres and win drawing away until eased up over the final 50 metres?

Just give me one.


Every single one of them if they were running against the tripe that Winx beat.

These horses that I named did not have the stable mates forming a guard of honour, were not in fields of less than eight usually made up of stable mates, took on challenges and took on all comers and above all, raced in a period when we had good, in fact very good, weight for age middle distance horses.

Winx beat goats in easily our most appalling period of weight for age horses.   Why don't you try and resurrect the forum you managed to  turn into a morgue by boring someone else.  Where is your good mate The Parrot. He loves your work.

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